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  1. opflipo

    Dieta

    eu populacija od 1961 611mil -> 747 mil. je torej razumljivo sklepati, da pojemo manj rdečega mesa? vseeno pa imamo porast kroničnih bolezni, blame the cows makes much sense, anyone care to explain?
  2. opflipo

    Dieta

    grem polako eno po eno iz povzetka: However, a number of gaps still exist. It is basic to establish the mechanisms leading to the increased risk of colorectal cancer (CRC) and other cancers arising from red and processed meat consumption = študije lahko razdelimo v tri glavne segmente (korelacijske -> mehanistične -> eksperimentalne), zgornja se jasno opredeli da je mehanizme šele potrebno prepoznati in vzpostaviti => Correlation does not imply causation evo tle maš eno tako korelacijsko: Divorce rate in Maine correlates with Per capita consumption of margarine (US) 😂 https://www.tylervigen.com/view_correlation?id=1703 iz citatov spodaj pod povzetkom: ... When specific dietary habits were considered, CRC subjects showed a higher consumption of red meat (i.e., a higher intake of SFA) and alcohol, combined with a lower intake of legumes and fish. These findings are in agreement with previous papers showing that low consumption of fruit, vegetables and legumes, all food rich in dietary fibers, and elevated red and processed meat intake are associated to a higher risk of developing CRC [2, 28,33]. Prospective studies have also evidenced the correlation between high alcohol consumption and the risk for developing CRC later in life [34][35][36]. ... = kvaliteta prehrane in način življenja šteje = healthy user bias Več v zvezi s tem linkom se mi ne da več, ker tole je blo čisto na začetku branja.
  3. opflipo

    Dieta

    zarad mene naj vsak je kar mu paše. osebno meso in mesne izdelke jem točno zaradi zdravja. okoljsko gledano je 90% užitih živalskih proizvodov lokalnih (ribe so ali jadran ali pa eu, nekaj malega iz drugih koncev sveta), glede moralnih zadržkov; živali doživljam kot čutna bitja, sposobna vzpostavljanja čustvene vezi, prepoznavanja ipd. ampak pri tem sprejemam tudi njihovo potrebo nekaterih po mesu in s tem tudi svojo. na podoben način doživljam svojo postavitev v svet, doživljanje in sprejemanje notranjega konflikta in nasprotja, da zame umre žival s katero se na nekem nivoju doživljanja lahko identificiram ali globje na nivoju življenja samega, kjer pa hitro zaplavam v vode dvoličnosti ob zavedanju globalnega človeškega statusa. žival > človek? kolikšen hipokrit sem (bi bil), če se moralno trepljam, ker zame ne umirajo živali, a samo danes je že umrlo + 12000 ljudi zaradi pomanjkanja hrane, pa "ne trznem" ob tem. https://www.worldometers.info/ glede na ta graf se je po skali znatno povečala predvsem proizvodnja svinjine in perutnine. krive so pa itak krave za vse 😂
  4. fat but fit is the new thing 😄
  5. opflipo

    Dieta

    samo quick reply, jutri se priložnostno lotim branja linkov, kar pa si ne upam trdit zate, da si prebral vsaj zadnjega in poslušal prispevek. ma kaj si se zej zlepil z mc "memom", pismo no, a gre za nek veganski, vegetarijanski butthurt, ki ga moja omnivor narava ne prebere? 😄 še vedno tudi v primeru mc-a velja, da lahko poješ 10 tistih patijev, pa si boš še vedno naredil manj metabolične škode, kot če poješ en fucking meni. point je, da je anti-meat znanost bazirana na epidemioloških in živalskih študijah, ki so v "pompozni" opredelitvi who bile cherry pickane in so navkljub temu izpadle izredno weak: meat cancer risk 0,18% v primerjavi s cigareti 10-30% cancer risk, zato je vleči kakršne koli vzporednice med mesom in cigareti popolnoma napačno. podobno velja za appeal to authority (cancer research inštituti) - maš cel kup inštitutov, ki raziskujejo iste stvari in prihajajo do različnih zaključkov, ker študije pač niso zastonj. prehrambna industrija je sicer polna zlaganih zgodb (maščobe, olja, sladkor, zdravljenje diabetesa, bolezni srca in ožilja) in te zgodbe se v zadnjih 20 letih bolj jasno razkrivajo. isto bo z mesom, strah pred mesom realno ni nič drugega kot prestrašenost tipa "za vsak slučaj" ampak hej, mogoče se premislim ob prebiranju podanih virov. kakšna kritičnost točno mi manjka, glede česa, da meso ni kancerogeno, da gre za isto weak znanost? a misliš na tisti dve nalepljeni sliki, ki tako čudovito izpostavljata who zlaganost, pristranskost, nestrokovnost glede opredeljenosti mesa? mogoče glede lchf, glede insulina? znanost glede tega je stara vsaj 70 let in je v zadnjih 20 letih eksplodirala in jo niti približno ne moreš primerjat z antimeat znanostjo - celo prehrambne smernice so jo upoštevale in se umaknile korak nazaj glede demonizacije maščob kot glavnega krivca za bolezni srca in ožilja. potencialno pozitivne efekte lchf se omenja celo v slovenskih priporočilih za diabetike (omenja za povišan hdl in znižane trigliceride) ... tako sorry megla kam ciljaš s pomanjkanjem kritičnosti, care to explain more? 🙂 ? sladkor = OHji = približno 50/50 razmerje glukoze in fruktoze
  6. opflipo

    Dieta

    In ne nazadnje še tole; sicer v zgornjem članku opiše princip epidemioloških študij, a za boljše razumevanje študij na splošno prilagam en super povzetek ... With that being said about meat & cancer - CASE CLOSED until proven otherwise 🙂
  7. opflipo

    Dieta

    WHO Says Meat Causes Cancer? https://www.diagnosisdiet.com/full-article/meat-and-cancer
  8. opflipo

    Dieta

    Dietary Intake of Red Meat, Processed Meat, and Poultry and Risk of Colorectal Cancer and All-Cause Mortality in the Context of Dietary Guideline Compliance† https://www.mdpi.com/2072-6643/13/1/32/htm Published: 23 December 2020 Meat intake has been linked to increased risk of colorectal cancer (CRC) and mortality. However, diet composition may affect the risks. We aimed to estimate associations between red and processed meat and poultry intake and risk of CRC and all-cause mortality and if they are modified by dietary quality using Cox regression analyses. We found no significant association between red and processed meat intake and CRC risk. For poultry, increased CRC risk for high versus low intake (HR 1.62; 95%CI 1.13–2.31) was found, but not when examining risk change per 100 g increased intake. We showed no association between meat intake and all-cause mortality. The association between meat intake and CRC or mortality risk was not modified by dietary quality.
  9. opflipo

    Dieta

    Low-carbohydrate diets and the risk of pancreatic cancer: a large prospective cohort study https://academic.oup.com/carcin/advance-article-abstract/doi/10.1093/carcin/bgab006/6106538?redirectedFrom=fulltext Published: 22 January 2021 A population-based cohort of 95962 individuals was identified. Similar results were obtained for animal and vegetable low-carbohydrate-diet scores. In conclusion, low-carbohydrate diets, regardless of the type of protein and fat, are associated with a lower risk of pancreatic cancer in the US population, suggesting that adherence to low-carbohydrate-diets may be beneficial for pancreatic cancer prevention. Future studies should validate our findings in other populations.
  10. opflipo

    Dieta

    High carbohydrate diet implicated in pancreatic cancer https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1169472/ BMJ. 2002 Sep 14; 325(7364): 566. They identified 180 cases of pancreatic cancer from among 88802 women who were monitored for 18 years as part of the Nurses Health Study. This is a longitudinal health characteristics survey that started in 1976 with a cohort of 121700 registered nurses aged 30-55. Only ductal adenocarcinomas were studied. Women who were overweight and sedentary and had a high glycaemic load and high fructose intake were at greater risk of pancreatic cancer, with a relative risk of 2.67 (95% confidence interval 1.02 to 6.99). The researchers speculate that impaired glucose tolerance may be to blame and that insulin may act as a growth factor for pancreatic cancer. The study was conducted only in women, but Dr Fuchs said there was no reason to believe the results would not also apply to men. The researchers are now looking to see if there might be other modifiable dietary or behavioural risk factors, apart from smoking, for the development of the disease. Over 30000 Americans are diagnosed with pancreatic cancer every year. The disease has a poor prognosis, with only 4% of patients surviving five years.
  11. opflipo

    Dieta

    tole ne? poznam od oka korelacijo na nitrate, primerjava s čiki je popolnoma nov nivo veganske prizadetosti 🙂 ne ciljam na nikogar osebno, če se kdo najde, je to zato ker se najde 😂
  12. opflipo

    Dieta

    so si res? kakšne raziskave pa, tiste ki govorijo o korelaciji ali tiste, ki govorijo o vzročnosti? ena bolj odmevnih anti-mesnih študij, splošno sprejeta kot legitimna je bla sestavljena iz glej ga zlomka rastlinojedega samooklicanega komiteja, njihov pristop k filtriranju vseh mesnih raziskav pa milo rečeno lahko označimo za cherry picking. ne vem dej mi kej za prebrat. kak link do študije ali pa članek z viri. poznam nekaj malega ampak nič do te mere, da bi se zamislil, kar se tiče uživanja mesa. res pa je, da pojem malo procesiranega mesa in uživam beljakovine v zelo širokem spektru; meso ( goveje, piščančje, ribe, svinjine skoraj nič), jajca, stročnice, mlečni izdelki, whey. salam in paštet praktično ne jem. kakšno meso ješ je precej odvisno od tega kje živiš - v EU je boljše ko v ZDA, v Slo je boljše kot v EU na splošno - po drugi strani je v ZDA trg z grass fed&grass finished mesom, za primerno ceno. kolikor je meni znano ima višji faktor tveganja za razvoj kroničnih bolezni, vključno z rakom inzulinska odpornost - zato low carb skupnost demonizira ohje. problem seveda niso ohji per se ampak prekomerno uživanje njih => njih slastnost ter vpliv na center možganov za nagrajevanje v kombinaciji z nizkim razmerjem sitosti na užito kalorijo, skratka ohjev se je precej lažje prenajesti kot zelenjave, sadja, mesa, mesnih izdelkov. zato so ohji "nevarni" v prenesenem pomenu. dan danes večina ljudi poje preveč cukra, preveč težko procesiranih ohjev v kombinaciji s preveč rafiniranimi maščobami in potem meso v medijih postane krivec za raka - milo rečeno zavajanje in zastraševanje. iz vidika znanosti je precej bolj intelektualno iskreno, če raka povežemo z metaboličnim sindromom. prva dva zadetka na temo cancer and insulin resistance: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2815827/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3595327/ ena za bonus: povezava med inzulinsko odpornostjo in kroničnimi boleznimi: osebki, ki so imeli "low insulin resistance" torej normalen inzulinski odziv so bili brez pojavnosti bolezni ali s tem povezanih smrti; for the appearance of the following age-related diseases: hypertension, coronary heart disease, stroke, cancer, and type 2 diabetes. - a vidiš kako ta študija ne dopušča, da katero koli bolezensko stanje povežeš z mesom? ga ne moreš, ker meso ne povzroča inzulinske odpornosti. https://academic.oup.com/jcem/article/86/8/3574/2848584Baseline measurements of insulin resistance and related variables were made between 1988–1995 in 208 apparently healthy, nonobese (body mass index < 30 kg/m2) individuals, who were then evaluated 4–11 yr later (mean ± SEM = 6.3 ± 0.2 yr) for the appearance of the following age-related diseases: hypertension, coronary heart disease, stroke, cancer, and type 2 diabetes. Twenty-eight out of the total 40 clinical events were seen in 25 individuals (36%) in the most insulin-resistant tertile, with the other 12 occurring in the group with an intermediate degree of insulin resistance. Furthermore, insulin resistance was an independent predictor of all clinical events, using both multiple logistic regression and Cox’s proportional hazards analysis. The fact that an age-related clinical event developed in approximately 1 out of 3 healthy individuals in the upper tertile of insulin resistance at baseline, followed for an average of 6 yr, whereas no clinical events were observed in the most insulin-sensitive tertile, should serve as a strong stimulus to further efforts to define the role of insulin resistance in the genesis of age-related diseases.
  13. opflipo

    Dieta

    @lazaRus to lahk vzameš tud kot en meme na epidemiološke raziskave, kjer vlečejo korelacije na uživanje mesa in zdravstvene zaplete, v ozadju pa je pogosto prisoten healthy user bias, kjer ljudje ki uživajo več mesa, uživajo tudi več alkohola, kadijo, se manj gibljejo, jejo manj uravnoteženo hrano kot npr. mc food 😁, ki je visoko procesirano hrana v kombinaciji z mesom, al pa meso na pici itd.
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